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dr|z3d orignal: you're in someone's sights :) teddit.i2p/r/i2p/comments/zp8j2j/i2pd_developer_trusts_the_russian_government
Xeha lol
Xeha they cant even spell his name correctly
dr|z3d INFO […PReader 1/6] …rkDatabaseFacade: Peer [zQXMHP] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Tue Jul 29 22:57:31 GMT 2031
dr|z3d Peer [p6Kv8M] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Sun May 16 14:52:42 GMT 2038
dr|z3d Peer [1Q2Xxi] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Thu Dec 30 22:43:48 GMT 2100
dr|z3d Peer [hGXAhz] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Fri Oct 20 18:26:42 GMT 2023
dr|z3d Peer [9jCtNr] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Sat Jun 28 21:06:05 GMT 2025
dr|z3d Peer [a1W29t] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Sun Apr 23 00:24:02 GMT 2023
dr|z3d Peer [ZQ0LLc] published their RouterInfo in the future
dr|z3d • Publish date: Mon Feb 01 07:39:29 GMT 2027
dr|z3d just a hunch, but this doesn't look accidental.
zzz clock fixes coming today because I got blown up twice in a week
zzz orignal, yes, I am concerned about clock bias
zzz please change to "round"
zzz please check and change NTCP2 also
zzz thank you
zzz dr|z3d, LFnvaZ8Qa-0IRiz55PsQlk6Bw3EZ6J5tHsIv5UHtdtE=
dr|z3d what oddball behavior you seeing on that one, zzz?
zzz some hop throttles but maybe false alarm
zzz build success just hit lowest in a decade at least
dr|z3d given what I've been seeing lately, I have a feeling that's by design.
dr|z3d either that or a whole bunch of seeminly unrelated bugs are surfacing at the same time which seems unlikely.
zzz ok holler if you see any new culprits
dr|z3d what did you make of those future routers?
dr|z3d all within a couple of minutes of each other.
zzz nothing new, and haven't seen very often, hard to say
zzz add'l defenses checked in
dr|z3d yeah, same, not something I've seen much, but 2100!!! that's beyond clockskew issues.
dr|z3d speaking of the addl defences, super minor logging typo you got going on in a couple of places. Stratrum -> Stratum.
zzz ok thx
dr|z3d np. minor, but noticed as I'm in the process of manual mergery.
zzz LFnv looks like a healthy X router
zzz attacker can easily drive a X router to get caught in other people's throttles
zzz which is why I think it's a bad idea to ban for hop throttle, at least not for more than a few minutes
zzz otherwise attacker could drive whole network to collapse
dr|z3d yeah, a few minutes is what I'm currently banning for.
zzz ok
dr|z3d and given my throttle's a bit more lax than yours, not much gets caught in it, though I've seen some stuff snared since I tightened it.
dr|z3d another future router, this one from 2027.
zzz anything in common among these?
dr|z3d not that I can tell. I'm trying to get them in the short-term sin bin so I don't have to constantly monitor the logs.
zzz i2pd? java?
zzz I don't think java will go more than 25 years out
zzz ref: BuildTime
dr|z3d I don't know, I don't think I'm snagging the routerid the correct way, so searches are coming up blank. and temp banning also failing.
dr|z3d String riHash = routerInfo.getIdentity().getHash().toBase64().substring(0,6);
dr|z3d if (routerInfo.getPublished() > now + 2*Router.CLOCK_FUDGE_FACTOR) {
dr|z3d long age = routerInfo.getPublished() - now;
dr|z3d if (_log.shouldWarn()) {
dr|z3d _log.warn("Peer [" + riHash + "] published their RouterInfo in the future\n* Publish date: " + new Date(routerInfo.getPublished()));
dr|z3d _log.warn("Banning [" + riHash + "] for 15m -> RouterInfo from the future!");
dr|z3d }
dr|z3d _context.banlist().banlistRouter(routerInfo.getIdentity().getHash(), " <b>➜</b> RouterInfo from the future (" +
dr|z3d new Date(routerInfo.getPublished()) + ")", null, null, 15*60*1000);
zzz yeah you can't search for them
dr|z3d ah, yeah, course, they don't make it to the netdb.
zzz you'd have to log the full RI just before the ban
zzz I believe we do in SSU2
dr|z3d so looking at the above, I guess it's fail because I'm trying to ban using a non-existent routerinfo as the reference.
zzz no, you ban by hash, that works
dr|z3d yeah, except it's not working for some reason. nothing turning up in the banlist :|
dr|z3d the only thing at this stage I've noticed is that sometimes you'll see 1/2 dozen routers with future routerinfos all turn up at more or less the same time.
zzz you;ll see the full RI for SSU2 with EstablishmentManager at WARN
zzz ofc if you are ff then you'll get a lot more of them as database stores
zzz transports will usually catch skew before it gets to netdb
dr|z3d yeah, so I'm thinking that's probably why the call to routerinfo.getPublished().getHash() isn't working because there's no RI to pull the hash from.
zzz if routerInfo were null you'd NPE
dr|z3d hmm, yeah, I guess.
dr|z3d so idk why I'm not seeing bans. oh well.
dr|z3d anyways, I'm suggesting short term bans for anything that looks like it might be hostile. 5-10m. excessive hop requests, hostile requests, future routerinfos.
dr|z3d it'll at least place the RI's in the banlist so they can be investigated, without doing too much harm given the brevity of the ban.
dr|z3d s/RI's/hashes
dr|z3d pv44hG seems to be a recurring futures merchant.
dr|z3d (2030)
orignal dr|z3d the source is kislitsa.i2p ))
dr|z3d of that particular future routerinfo, orignal?
orignal zzz, but I don't understand why should I publish clock from future?
orignal about that page
dr|z3d oh, you mean orignal is working for the FSB? that one?
orignal it's well known )))
orignal but really back to timestamp from future. why?
dr|z3d for routerinfos? either misconfiguration malicious intent?
dr|z3d *or
orignal no, it's zzz change
orignal because he rounds timestamps instead truncate
dr|z3d oh, we're not talking about routerinfos from 2100 then? ok, I'll butt out.
zzz orignal, it's max 500 ms in the future
zzz the potential problem is when we adjust our local clock to the median of all the peers
orignal dr|z3d kislitsa.i2p/i2p/59642
orignal the original topic ))
zzz if the median is biased, then the network could gradually adjust down down down
orignal zzz but why I should even round it
zzz to prevent bias
orignal so where do you want to to do?
orignal timestamp block for NTCP2 and SSU2?
zzz send ms + 500 / 1000 in both SSU2 and NTCP2 DateTime block, yes
orignal zzz another question
orignal when you connect through NTCP2 do you validate your own RI?
orignal if timestamp is not too old
zzz looking...
orignal fine will do
zzz thank you very much :)
orignal people complain about errors in SessionCorimed that RI is too old
orignal hmm for i2pd I don't truncate anything
orignal I take seconds from system clock
orignal *for NTCP2
zzz The max time before we rebuild our RI is 43 minutes
orignal I check for 90 minutes
orignal and get RIs older in SessinConfirmed
zzz i2pd or java?
orignal not sure
orignal people see it in the logs
zzz yeah, it's strange, because I reject skew in session or token request and send termination
orignal now skew
zzz I don't know how you send a RI that's way too old or in the future in session confirmed but you had the right time in session request
orignal clock is fine
orignal RI is old
zzz right
orignal e.g. timestamp in it
zzz I just looked through my logs, all the routers I see with times in the future are i2pd
orignal how can you explain it?
zzz no ideas...
orignal for how long in future?
zzz dr|z3d reported year 2100 above
orignal in which message?
dr|z3d 2100, 2023, 2038.. all over the shop.
zzz I think the most I've seen in SSU2 is 91 days in the future, but I'm not logging the same things dr|z3d is, I'm not floodfill
zzz he's seeing 100x the traffic I see
orignal in SessionRequest or SessionCreated?
orignal so you want me take millisecnds and round to seconds for NTCP2?
zzz yes please, same as SSU2
zzz zgrep -i 'in the future' log*|wc -l
zzz 171
zzz that covers about a week
zzz mostly session created but some relay too
zzz I think session/token request is a different log line
orignal commited
zzz thx :)
zzz there should be very few java routers with bad clocks because we have NTP and also as backup take time from peer median, DoH headers, and reseed HTTP headers
zzz I did fix a few bugs today for some corner cases, but those only happen if NTP fails
zzz I found those by testing with NTP and reseed and NTCP2 and SSU1 _all_ disabled
orignal we don't use NTP by deafult
dr|z3d mostly not seeing the issues on floodfill routers, zzz, or at all.
zzz interesting
dr|z3d to clarify, not monitoring floodfills, the logs all coming from non-ff routers. not that ff routers don't have those issues, just haven't been looking at the ffs.
orignal we see to much transit in last few days
orignal sometimes I hit 100 Mbs cap of the network port
dr|z3d yeah, that'll be what we're calling the tunnel spammers.
orignal how do you know if it's not real traffic?
dr|z3d depends what you mean by real. 42MB/s is definitely real.
dr|z3d what's also real is the fact that the requests seem to be originating from 1 or 2 routers.
orignal where?
orignal I see traffic not requests
dr|z3d before we identified the culprits and blocked them, I was seeing 42MB/s on one of the stormycloud outproxy routers.
dr|z3d all transit, not op traffic.
dr|z3d and also was watching part tunnels scale from, say 5K to 12K in a few minutes. not normal. tunnel spammers.
dr|z3d I suspect 42MB/s would have been much higher were it not for the fact that ~40MB/s seems to be about as much as a quadcore VPS can handle.
dr|z3d yeah, as I was saying, orignal, it's definitely 1 or 2 routers generating a huge amount of traffic and tunnel requests. either maliciously, or just cluelessly using some crufty BOB-enabled retroshare.
orignal it doesn't expain where thetraffic come from
dr|z3d and it's likely they're have a negative effect on the whole network.
orignal I see traffic not requests
orignal Transit Tunnels: 5776
orignal not too many
dr|z3d you running with default i2pd configs?
orignal ofc not
dr|z3d ok, just checking :)
dr|z3d almost 6K tunnels I think you'd find is above average.
orignal not too much for a floodfill
dr|z3d but anyways, just because your particular router's not seeing a huge number of requests doesn't mean they're not out there fucking up the network. which they are :)
dr|z3d tunnel build success network-wide is way down, zzz is reporting.
dr|z3d and it's not persistent, the tunnel request hike.. it spikes for a few minutes and then it's gone until the next one. the traffic spikes could last anywhere up to 8-12 hours at a time.
zzz 0) Hi
zzz hi
eyedeekay hi
zzz what's on the agenda for today?
zzz I have two:
orignal hi
zzz 1) peer test with firewalled charlie, continued from last week
orignal how you handle peer test at Bob
zzz 2) peer test proposal, didn't have time last week
orignal from last meeting
zzz is that the same as 1) or something different?
orignal different
orignal 1 and 2 are different
zzz ok, let's make 'how you handle peer test at bob' be 1a)
orignal yes
orignal you promised to tell
zzz eyedeekay, you have anything for the list?
zzz can always add at the end too
eyedeekay A very small go-i2p update
zzz ok you will be 3)
zzz 1) peer test with firewalled charlie, continued from last week
orignal yes, so what'syou conculsion?
zzz I promised to do research
zzz so I did
zzz as a reminder, orignal allows firewalled charlies, I currently do not
zzz my conclusion is that I can make the changes so I can handle it
orignal yes
orignal nice
dr|z3d can we make 4) your observations re network performance, zzz. just to put orignal in the picture?
zzz so I now agree with orignal and I'm planning to make those changes
zzz anything else on 1) or can we move on to 1a) ?
orignal no
zzz 1a) how you handle peer test as bob
orignal so my question is
orignal when Bob gets error code from charlie what do you do?
zzz until a week ago, I just forwarded the error to alice. Last week I checked in changes, Bob now asks a different charlie
zzz up to a max time or max number of charlies.
orignal yes I do the same
zzz did that answer your question?
orignal how many chrlies? 2?
zzz maybe 5 or so?
orignal idk
orignal I'm going to do the same
zzz ok. anything more you need to know?
orignal becuase too many errors back came from Charie
orignal no
orignal just to confirm
zzz ok
zzz on to 2) peer test proposal
zzz it's here which you probably have not read: zzz.i2p/topics/3489-proposal-ssu2-snat-test-improvement
zzz it's about how you find out if you are SNAT
zzz the SSU 1 spec says, if you don't get message 5, then stop the test
zzz but if you don't send message 6, you'll never find out if you are SNAT
orignal right
orignal you do
orignal when you connect to Bob
zzz so, proposal is wait a while, then send message 6 anyway
zzz for SSU2
zzz and also to fix up the documentation to make it more clear, because the SSU 1 docs are a mess, and we didn't copy that section to SSU 2 at all
orignal please explain how come I connect to Bob and don't know I'm SNAT?
orignal for SSU2
orignal Bob send address block in SessionCreated
zzz true, you can get the information in other ways
zzz but peer test would be better. Right now you can only be SNAT if you are not FIREWALLED from peer test.
orignal sending 6 could be a good idea only you receive 4
zzz which makes no sense
orignal huh?
orignal for me no difference
zzz SSU2 is better because msg 5 and msg 7 are different. In SSU 1 you can't tell the difference
orignal if I get different port in address block it means SNAT
zzz so you can figure out if you got msg 5 after sending msg 6
zzz anyway, not asking for any decisions today, please read the zzz.i2p post and we can talk about it more some other time
orignal fine
zzz anything else on 2) ?
orignal no
zzz 3) a very small go-i2p update
zzz you're up eyedeekay
eyedeekay Yeah sorry having trouble with lag today
eyedeekay Only real update is that I've finally got what I think is a working Noise-XK handshake and can send and recieve/encrypt and decrypt messages
zzz woot, congrats
zzz next steps?
eyedeekay I was pretty close to it last week as it turned out but finally got my head around the last few things this week
eyedeekay I need to figure out how to make the NTCP transport inherit from the Noise transport, and then add the ability to apply our mods to the handshake
zzz sounds like fun
zzz anything else on 3) ?
eyedeekay Nope, that's it for me
zzz 4) network performance
zzz I wasn't prepared to give a presentation, but if anybody has any questions I'll try to answer them, or dr|z3d this is your topic, if you want to lead
zzz last call for 4)
zzz we agreed last week that we're off on the 26th and the 2nd
orignal so
dr|z3d you want me to start, zzz, or you've got it covered?
orignal yes please
zzz somebody go, not my topic
dr|z3d sure, I can say a few words by way of observations.
dr|z3d essentially we've been seeing some fairly atypical behavior on the network lately.
dr|z3d regular spikes in tunnel requests, huge sustained hikes in bandwidth usage over several hours.
dr|z3d additionally, some strange behavior has been observed including future routerinfos from 2100, requests that place us two hops in the tunnel chain, and various other stuff.
dr|z3d am I lagged?
orignal no
dr|z3d ok, good. maybe zzz is then.
orignal I see abnormal transit traffic but that's all
zzz stats.i2p/cgi-bin/parttunnels-day.cgi
orignal no major issues
zzz stats.i2p/cgi-bin/avg.cgi?a=tunnel.buildExploratorySuccess.10m&s=31&u=m
dr|z3d so, it's hard to know at this stage if the behavior is part of some sustained attack and an attempt to probe for weaknesses, or just some incompetents running retorshare and BOB and absolutely hammering the network.
orignal or more traffic
zzz orignal, one router was appearing at 20 different IPs per hour, all over the globe
dr|z3d or it could be some latent bugs are now being exposed, maybe due to SSU2.
zzz that router I'd call an attack
orignal but what's thier goal?
zzz doesn't matter and impossible to know
zzz even classifying attack vs. user error is a waste of time mostly
orignal not realy
orignal they they used kinds "p2p vpn"
dr|z3d like I mentioned earlier, with a couple of routers blocked, the traffic on the router's I'm watching has returned to what one might describe as normal bandwidth patterns.
zzz we're monitoring the situation closely. If things get bad we could do a release on short notice. Hopefully not necessary
zzz we're currently at the worst exploratory build success in maybe 10 years
dr|z3d if the goal is to destabilize the network and frustrate users, then perhaps it's having some effect.
dr|z3d but we can only speculate.
dr|z3d is it a continuation of the attack on Tor by other means? also possible.
dr|z3d it's curious that one of stormycloud's outproxy routers got hit hard, repeatedly.
dr|z3d massive traffic (up to 42MB/s).. restart router, almost instantly traffic resumes at previous levels.
zzz it's some combination of attacks and SSU2 bugs
orignal yes I see low success rate
zzz if we go down below 20% expl. success (sustained) I'll probably call for a release
dr|z3d question, zzz. is there anything you think i2pd might be able to do to mitigate this that it's not doing?
orignal when?
zzz I'd rather not do a release before mid-january.
zzz but if we have to I will. Don't want to wait until everything breaks
zzz dr|z3d, I'm not in a position to offer i2pd design advice
zzz other than fix all the SSU2 bugs soon :)
orignal which bugs?
zzz anything else on 4) ?
zzz none in particular
zzz just anything that keeps it from working reliably
dr|z3d ok, well, no design advice from zzz, then orignal. :)
dr|z3d I think we covered the network perf issues. I'll keep reporting any anomalies.
zzz anything else for the meeting?
orignal no
zzz happy holidays, thanks everybody
dr|z3d happy crystal methmas to all!
zzz if we do both decide to release, we need to coordinate on whether to go from 0.9.56 to .57 or not, so stay in touch
orignal fine
dr|z3d the other thing to keep an eye on, orignal, is known peers in your netdb. that's also seeing a considerable ramp up on occasion. like now.
zzz orignal, can you please stop i2pd from publishing a "::1" IP? 2.7% of the routers (well over 100) in my netdb are publishing ::1
zzz I do validate the IP later but it still screws me up some
dr|z3d this is where ranges and masks for ipv6 would come in handy :)
dr|z3d eg: <a href="https://freenetworktutorials.com/ipv4-and-ipv6-bogon-address-list/" target="_blank">Bogon</a>:;;1/128
zzz no. as I said, we validate it later, but that's more expensive
dr|z3d how do you validate localhost? are you assuming later the router will have self-corrected and is publishing a public ip?
zzz well, invalidate
zzz via TranportUtil.isPubliclyRoutable()
dr|z3d ah, ok.
zzz orignal, if your IP is ::1 please don't publish a IPv6 address at all, for either NTCP2 or SSU2
dr|z3d but that's expensive, you're saying? so there's no value in a default ipv6 bogon blocklist to pre-empt that?
zzz the method mentioned above _is_ our validity check for ipv6
zzz the point is that comes after cheap checks for a ipv6 address
zzz please don't undercut me when I'm asking i2pd to fix something
dr|z3d sorry, wasn't intending to undercut you. not my intention. was just trying to get a handle on why the cheapest check of all, namely blocklist masks/ranges, are the first port of call for blocking private ipv6.
dr|z3d *aren't.
dr|z3d orignal: ::1 is calling and it's wearing a grunch suit!
dr|z3d *grinch
dr|z3d that's my attempt at humor, and no, I'm not associating you with the grinch, zzz. :)
zzz you wanted me to make suggestions to i2pd, so here's one, and now you're saying I'm wrong
dr|z3d no, I'm not saying you're wrong at all.
dr|z3d I think preventing i2pd from publishing private addresses is entirely reasonable.
dr|z3d That doesn't mean you can't *also* look at other strategies to mitigate what's apparently a pain point. orignal fixing the issue in i2pd will still leave older routers out there.
dr|z3d and supporting masks/ranges in ipv6 isn't just about localhost, either. no doubt in time we'll encounter entire ipv6 ranges that may be desirable to block en masse.